OFFICIAL: Season 1 Heroes Discussion Thread!

[Mreen]

Oh - it occurred to me, belatedly, a possible Linderman motive (still pretty weak considering the hold he has over Nathan, but ) -you pointed out Nathan has been traveling around. What if he saw Nathan disappear with $100,000 in Texas and thought the guy was embezzling his election fund, the four million he gave Nathan being frittered away at ..

Anyhow, its the only motive I can put any credence to just yet. Still voting more strongly for the test run.

Also, Jessica's argument with Niki - makes it sound like she did the shrink in so she could use her to negotiate a release - the shrink shouldnt have had a phone on her in a real prison, but we saw the taser had been torn apart and the wires redone.. I had this idea that Jessica phoned Linderman to make a deal after she put out the psychiatrist. Thinking about it in more awake hours tho.. it doenst make sense. I cant suspend disbelief even for TVland that a prison psychiatrist would have a cell phone inside the prison, and the idea that a taser has all the parts to be wired to communicate with Linderman is way too farfetched. Sorry .. scratch that one. Back to the psychiatrist set it up.

[sleeper]

I think most of the diamonds aren't real, because the jewelery was in on the set up. That is why Jessica was not told to get the diamonds and didn't tear the place apart trying to find them.

[Mreen]

I think they were real - the jeweler wasnt too worried about that - he said he was offering a good deal and then thought 'not that it matters, Linderman's (hitman) will be here any minute' - he took the money ..I'd have think the thoughts would be more like "like you could tell these fakes from the real thing" if they were fake.

Linderman was supposed to get to him before he bought the jewels, the jeweler wouldnt have wanted to tip his hand with fake diamonds I would think.

Besides, there really isnt any drama in them being fake diamonds, so in that sense they have to be real.

[chryse]

Linderman was warning Jessica/Nikki not to steal from him again when he told her about the diamonds. Now that they are gone, he's gonna suspect her first. She's gonna get into a big a trouble over that, she may even put 2 and 2 together and come up with Matt and go after him over it.

Getting Jessica to go after Nathan may just be a test of her loyalty to Linderman too. She remembers Nathan, but told her contact over the phone (I can't believe that she's really talking to Linderman directly, it's too direct a connection to him and the killings) that she wouldn't have a problem with it either. Maybe it's Dragon Lady from the hotel when Nikki and Nathan first met?

[Mreen]

yeah .. but he just paid 4million to keep Nathan useful, I cant believe he's going to waste him for real. And no, I dont think she'd be talking with Linderman directly either. That's more for someone at Nathan's level.


..too late for me to get going with this, but:

I think next ep is going to be all about those family meetings Michah wanted, going on in at least 2 houses

[sleeper]

Nice cameo appearance by Stan Lee as the bus driver that said Hi to Hiro. It was great to see Peter being able to control his powers and use them to escape HRG and fight Isaac. Interesting that the Haitian was not able to get close to Peter in time to neutralize him... but Peter is a wild card... he is like Sylar except Sylar has to kill his victims to steal IDs. Looks like Sylar might have bitten off more than he can control in taking that woman's hearing ablities. Now that Matt, RM, and the radio has HRG family... what are they going to do with them?
Can Peter use Claire's ablity to heal to somehow heal Simone or is she toast?

And Nathan is still a shark....

(Ok so I was wrong about the diamonds... at least the wife was trying to get him to return them.)

[KaraS]

Wow! That was some episode!

The HRG had a really bad day. First he misses Claude and Peter, then his wife colapses, then Claire tells him off, loudly and publicly, in the hospital, then he is confronted by Matt, Ted and Hannah in his home in front of his family. Not even John Crichton had days that bad!

I trust Matt not to harm Clair, her brother or mother, but I'm not so sure about Ted or Hannah.

Hiro told Ando to get lost after he allowed himself to be bamboozled by the Bimbo in the cassino.

Claude took a powder.

Peter and Isaac fought over Simone, with tragic consequences.

Mohinder and "Zane" visited a woman in Montana and she wound up dead, with her skull cut off. How many such occurances do you think it will take before Mohinder figures out that the guy he's traveling around with is the man who killed his father?

[Mreen]

Unaired tag scene:

As they drive off, 'Zane' clutching his skull, Mohinder ponders briefly how to distract his distressed companion from the horrifying site. Fortunately, his breif sojourn as a taxi driver left him many insights in how American's deal with stress in long rides.

"I know," he tells Zane cheerfully, "Let's sing showtunes!"






Screen fades to black as Zane's eyes roll in helpless agony.

[chryse]

No Nikki/Jessica, Micah and DL this ep. hmmmmm Is Jessica flying off to NYC now? And just how do you explain the trip to Micah and DL?

Peter is scary when he's mad. Simone is dead. Last week's ep ended with them asking who was gonna die, and led us to believe it might be Claire's adoptive mother, Mrs. Bennett. But no, it's Simone. Poor girl. But really, what was she thinking? Asking her ex, who still loves her, to help her find her current lover? Geez woman. It was bound to end up badly. But wow, Peter, you got some GOOD moves now! Very cool. Looks like he learned something from Claude after all. I wonder what Peter's gonna do to Isaac next ep? *shudder*

sleeper, it looks like the Haitian has to be able to direct his power-canceling powers. He could do that to Matt when Matt was jacking Bennett up a wall, but not when Peter was somewhere nearby but invisible, so Haitian couldn't pinpoint Peter. Interesting limitation.

I agree, Sylar bit off more than he could chew. Up until now, at least that we've seen, he's only gotten powers where he controls things outside his body, and it was relatively easy for him to catch on to it. But Dale's super-hearing is inside his body, and he's having a hard time adjusting. I doubt it'll keep him down for very long, but it make him more cautious of what powers he might want to acquire in the future.

So, if Peter got Sylar's acquired telekinesis, did he get all of the other powers Sylar acquired also? Or just the one that was used in front of Peter?

Claude is REALLY afraid of Bennett. whoa. Scary. Tasers in rain.. bad!

I think Mohinder is already suspicious of "Zane".. at least I really hope so. Sylar's a scary good actor.

Ok Wireless-girl. Where the hezmana did you come from?

Kara wrote : <Hiro told Ando to get lost after he allowed himself to be bamboozled by the Bimbo in the cassino.>

I saw it a different way. Hiro apologizing to Ando for getting him caught up in this mess and excusing him from coming along for his own safety, whether or not Ando liked it. Hiro's feeling guilty for putting his friend in danger and now, he's making him stay out of any future danger. And yay! Hiro does still have his powers, even if he didn't see it. LOL

It's about time HRG had a really bad day! Karma baby, It's a witch! I wonder what answers we'll be getting next week? Probably not as much as want. I don't they know what questions to ask, unless WirelessGirl knows even more than she's saying, which is little enough so far.

mreen! LOL!

Stan had a nice cameo.

Ok, Matt's wife's jeweler is an idiot. She brings in a ring to resize and he tells her it's stolen? How do you know dummy? Great way to build your business. It could just as easily been a gift or something inherited and recently put into a new setting. The ring wasn't stolen, only the diamond. Did the police report specify which diamonds (and their ID numbers) were stolen? It was an "illegal" transaction for the diamond guy and Malsky that wasn't even supposed to be completed, so why would there be a record?

next week should be interesting. I wonder where Ando's going to go. I don't think he's going to abandon Hiro so easily.

[Mreen]

That's a point - when we first saw Blink taking on Matt, he was sitting, hunched over, clutching his genome medallion and concentrating fiercely. He was only able to gradually block out Matt's powers, as the white noise got fiercer.

Later Matt woke up and Blink was already in the room - presumably ready this time. I think the field Blink puts out might be natural for anyone within a few feet of him, like Peter automatically absorbing powers only if someone is "really close", but he can project it if he chooses. At the police station Blink had had some practice with Matt, and seemed to throw his field around HRG (who kept Claire within a few feet at all times) As long as Blink was sneaking around behind Matt to project it, it was working. (He could just as easily been throwing it around Matt, it makes just as much sense, but I'm thinking his goal would be to block HRGs thoughts more than anything else)

Matt, tho, shows Blinks field isnt perfect. Despite an estimated 14yrs of practice to Matt's few weeks, Matt has been able to pull at least one word out of HRG's head during Blink's concentrated efforts when he really wants too. First "Claire" then later, "Sylar" I dont think Matt's power is as easily blocked as HRG and Blink think.. so

Blink has limitations. His powers arent any more perfect than Peter's control and Hiro's efforts. He's got tons of practice, but he's seeing things go wrong with them, not the least of which is the fate of Mrs Bennet. Blink, for all his years of loyalty, is about to face potential elimination from the cult if he doesnt watch his back. (Just my guess ..he's the ultimate loyal watch your back 'assistant' - but when he made a decision to go against HRG's orders, it took only two weeks before he was found out)

*Blink:not to self, when asking Claire if she can keep a secret, the answer is No!

alas poor Blink ...

looks like HRG did not get the memo out here concerning increasing security for his house... unless he did and the armed guards are already pouring in, but Matt may let us know shortly.

Possible outcome I see that would save HRG's family (despite the fact that it really is karma, he's done so much against his family to preserve it 'just the way it was' -refusing to let his wife grow or know him, so that she'd never "have to know" about evil in the world - let alone how much of it he festers in his cause - but to get back to the beginning of this sentence) is that they all agree to let Blink erase HRG's knowledge of what happened that night, that he alone forgets about everyone else knowing what he's done, so he wont go after them.

I think that would be cool, tho I understand unlikely -it's still the outcome I am hoping for. Mrs Bennet (whose name we dont know.. for some reason I thought HRG's was Tom till Mrs pointed out we never heard it) cant get her memory erased again, she wont recover from it. There is the slight possibility HRG may order it anyway, since he seems willing to do so much harm to preserve his ideal family in his head, but surely Blink would shake his head this time.

My fear from the next ep is that they make HRG look too much like a good guy. He's terrorized everyone is his cold, clinical, scientific way for so long, (15yrs it seems) it would really be a let down if he's somehow now portrayed as 'just misunderstood'. I'm all for giving the bad guys believable motives, explain what drives them to such heartless acts in their belief of greater good of science ...but I dont want them to be some sappy good guy that we all just got wrong all this time. I mean, give me a break, let a bad guy be bad now and then!

I want to see him sappy over his family, so much tho that he does what he does to his wife to keep them 'perfect'. I want to see him so determined to have science worked out clinically he'll risk and even have subjects die for his experiments, so that he can better understand what is happening to these people. Show that he believes the science is more important than individual's lives, or even individual life, but how he lets it all break down to keep the one pet he loves as his own daughter.

Peter looks to have absorbed all of Sylar's powers (such as Sylar had them) during their 5 story fall and while he lay dead under him. (rewatched and yes, Sylar fell on top of Peter, tho his back struck the ground at some point)

So far we know Sylar levitates, telekinesis, and I think we safely speculate Sylar has bulletproof skin (I'll get into that later), he's got this deep voice thing that Peter used, and I think a super voice power - he yelled at Isaac and the force of it threw Isaac across the room - with that deep voice thing going on, I dont think that was just telekinesis. He also froze that little girl's father to death, so who knows when we'll see that.

I wonder if Peter will have absorbed Charlie's powers too - amazing memory and intelligence, and find himself spouting bits of books and parts of his dreams and piecing them altogether.

Sylar's melting metal and superhearing.. well, Peter will have to meet with Sylar first before he can do that. But when Sylar has those undercontrol, no cage can hold him and .. *shudder* I hate to think how his mood sensing ability will allow him to taunt his victims as he hears the others coming.

Hana/Wireless came from Israel .. you have read the comicbooks at NBC.com, ch 13 14 15 -(or Wireless parts 1-3) but be glad you didnt read them ahead of time as parts of it are thing that happen in this episode.

I imagine Jessica is indeed flying to NYC, unless Linderman ordered Nathan to him .. but I dont think so, with the election so close now, Nathan would be needed in NYC.

I really didnt think Simone was going to die. I thought Nathan was plotting against her, planning on discrediting her right now rather than risk her going public later (same attack plan he successfully used on Peter) Nathan is getting slimier and slimier, and just when he's about to get his just desserts .. well, who IS going to rescue this endangered shark?

They've been throwing it in our face lately, that the dream is a metaphor, not meant to be taken literally - but I still thought Isaac would be more literally keeping Simone apart from Peter, rather than the two of them eliminating her. Nathan and Simone are the two individuals that die in the dream before the whole city goes up...

Still, I cant help but wonder if there just isnt some way for Isaac and Peter to save her - maybe she lost consciousness from being shot.. Peter is a nurse, and he can fly her to a hospital .. even if they did say someone dies... does that mean they have to stay dead? Loophole, somewhere, maybe? Maybe not.

Isaac - wow - I knew he was going darkside but, I mean, just listening to HRG program him to kill Peter gave me chills. I thought Isaac might be the one who dies if he's running around in a mad panic with a gun in his hand. Sad to think how part of him seemed so sweet, and determined to 'save the world' - now he's as panicked as in his junkie days .. not a good future ahead for him, however long it lasts.

Loved how Claude/Chris (cant believe HRG referred to him as Claude!) was still the manical Ben Kenobi, beating his apprentice with sticks till he learns his lesson - I think he got a great kick out of knocking Peter out whenever he could. And then to have HRG find him, 14yr of hiding down the drain the one time he interacts with someone new - no wonder he blamed Peter and ran off. I still feel bad for him - doomed, with that tracer in his system. How long can he run if they know he's not dead?

Hiro and Ando .. ah, what can we say? It was cool to see Hiro still has his power (I think triggered not only by survival but Ando's cry "I dont want to die!") but sad to see them split up. I'm hoping Ando will step up and try to be a hero on his own .. even if it's only following the bus <g>

I wonder if Ando is the one to talk sense into Jessica, Niki was so clear to him that he must understand she wasnt the same person he saw on the internet, Ando was very respectful when he left. Perhaps he can remind her of that lesson somehow. I just dont want to see him go.

Hiro, of course, will be funny no matter where he goes ..but that moment with Stan Lee was so cute - remember how the only ID Hiro had on his trip Nov 8th was his 'Merry Marvel Marching Society' card? lol - what a talk between Hiro and Stan Lee! I'm going to NBC.com and seeing what they have about that... I wouldnt click on the link for fear of spoilers, but I guess its safe now.

Oh - the bullet proof skin. Sylar has been shot, and while the force of the bullets took him down, he popped back up shortly. Later he falls 5 stories (on top of Peter) he's limping, injured, but not massive bleeding like Peter (still heaving bleeding but not like Peter who was in a pool of blood)

HRG point out that Sylar has internal injuries, despite his apparent indestructabilty, and the doctors had to work hard to save his life and repair him. Lastly when Eden points the gun at his head, he laughs and says "You know that wont hurt me!"

Conclusion - someone had bulletproof skin, and Sylar got to him.

So, like wearing a vest/armour, it wont stop an injury, but it provides a lot of protection and 'padding' to decrease injuries. That's my conclusion anyway, that they wanted us to reach.

[Mreen]

and yes, gotta say the jeweler is a bit of an idiot ...plus, the jewelery wasnt stolen from the jeweler, it was just paid for with stolen money. Matt then stole it from the crime scene, but there is no proper owner (except Linderman who owned the stolen money) so no one to report it stolen.

It was nice to see that Matt's wife reacted exactly as I did, it was rediculous and there was no way Matt would do that sort of thing- so why the hell did he?

I like that she was insisting he call the precinct right in front of her, so she could be sure it was over ... bad timing for the call. I still fear Matts being programmed to be the next HRG - the way the ep ended, Janice is going to feel she has no choice but to leave him bcs he's not returning the stolen jewels. (there are clearly going to be delays till it was too late to return them, so they have lost the easy way out)

Its tearing Matt up inside to have them, and he's going to hate himself no matter what he does. So, what if he can get Blink to erase his wife's memory so that she doesnt know about it? HRG could offer him a way to save his marriage, the same way HRG always dealt with his. That's a large part of what drives HRG and it would be so easy for him to program Matt to be the same way .. I am just hoping Matt has got more backbone than that and will take the consquences for his unbelievably stupid actions .. I dont think he's got the courage for that tho. (Niki did) But I'm hoping he'll still refuse to let his wife be brainwashed.

Or worse yet, what if HRG does it anyway, and just tells Matt that its a present. A favor that he's going to call in.

You know, if the two of them start using Blink that way, that would just be too Stepford Wives-ish for me. ewwe. So, here's hoping Matt maintains some of the character we admired so much in him in the beginning.

[sleeper]

It's interesting that Sylar didn't realize that he hit the jackpot when he met Peter. Jeesh, if he took Peter's powers he could have used his future victim's powers against them to kill. But of course that would blow the story...stupid me So that might be why Sylar needs Claire's healing powers... he knows if he gets beat up enough he will die.

I think that we all realize that Matt isn't the sharpest knife in the police force. So he is going to do stupid things. But I don't think that he would ever join forces with HRG, especially when HRG made him look like a fool in front of the FBI. He wants HRG to suffer and be stopped. I just didn't like what wireless said when she met Radiation Man..."I want you to nuke him" (or something to that effect). Next week's episode will be very interesting.

[chryse]

I think you're being really hard on Matt. He's totally overwhelmed. Even if he wasn't a super, he'd still be up the creek without a paddle between his dyslexia, thwarted amibition, wife's indiscretion and her issues as well as his own. Being able to hear other peoples' thoughts has only made it worse because he's basically a good guy but the past 6 months have fallen on him like a ton of bricks and he still hasn't had a chance to even breathe, much less think. Like he told his wife, he's not sure what he was thinking and he's pretty much been in that state for 6 months, if not longer. We picked him up after he'd already failed his detective exam at least once and his marriage was already falling apart. Now he's not likely to ever get back on the force and his wife thinks he's a thief AND they are having a baby. It's only gotten from bad to worse and he still doesn't even know how he got there. No, if he goes bad it's because he'll hit rock bottom and loses his wife and child. If he ever gets a chance to catch his breath (not likely in the next 2 weeks before the boom), I'm pretty sure he'll figure things out, especially after he gets some answers from Bennett.

I think the last thing Matt wants is for Blink to be anywhere near his wife. And right now, HRG is in no position to be offering "services" of any kind to people who think he's the devil. And why would Matt even mention his marital problems to HRG anyway? That kind of stuff you tell your best friends, not your enemy. And if it was offered, you know Claire's gonna be right there saying Hell NO, look it what it did to my mom.

[chryse]

Oh, and not where did Wireless Girl come from as in where in the world... but why is she showing up like some deus ex machina? I hate that stuff. It's bad storytelling if they have to use one to advance the plot and even worse if they can't explain it during the show and you have to find out from their "complementary" sources.

[Mreen]

Actually I'm thinking there was a by the wayside clue about her in the pilot ep, the Israeli suicide bomb on the bus. She might have been around that and it meant something to her, just as the fire he painted matched the one Claire ran into in Odessa, when she saved that man.

I wonder if the beer was the drugged beer Matt was given at bar...

and yes, I am being hard on Matt, but I think he deserves it. He may not always have been the sharpest, but he wasnt stupid either, till he took this action with the diamonds. He may be upset his wife thinks he is a thief, but the fact of the matter is that his wife is right. He is a thief. He's going to have to go on some journey to get rid of the diamonds (and guilt) and try to win her trust back. Or at least his self respect.

And as for HRG - if Matt replaces him, that would be the ultimate humiliation and payback, so that's no barrier.

HRG spies on his subjects so he knows quite a lot of what happens, so its no surprise if he pieces together something about the stolen diamonds over the next few eps. Or simply sees the wife moving out /kicking Matt out, and makes the offer without knowing the cause.

Why would he make the offer - to get a hold over Matt. He likes be in control. He prefers his subjects off balance and easy to manipulate, so he can wind them up the way he wants (eg: programming Isaac to kill Peter) but Matt is almost too easy. Childs play. So, just as he was willing to wipe his beloved wife and children for their own good, he may decide at some point to offer the same deal to Matt, to tempt him to join. Look what the fringe benefits are to working with us +who else will hire you, kind of deal. Or whoever someday wants Matt to replace HRG will make the offer.

Reality ck, of course, says Matt could (at his current level on the playing field) never be equal to HRG. But supposing as he becomes more corrupt he seems to get cleverer - not really cleverer, but if you watch his character, he is considered a loser and a chump because he always did the right thing. He was honest, he admitted faults, and he said what was on his mind. And the resulting thoughts of everyone else was "loser" or easy to fool or when his wife wanted him gone. If he starts to figure out what lies make him look good, it would be a whole new world for him.

So its a possibility that I see 'out there'

Anyhow, all that is down the line and not going to happen before the Nov 8th bomb .. but as there must be a season 2 story, there is where Matt's going to go after that story ... at the moment, I see the HRG world sort of shrouding his character and that is one possible path for the story to follow. Maybe his personal revelations at the bomb site will take him from that (I figure most of the characters are going to have deeply personal revelations then, that propel them into that massive show up and amazing finale that we all know must come )

But yes, Matt is incredibly overwhelmed and yes, I am hoping Claire's input on the horror of living in a family like that stick with Matt should the offer come sooner rather than later.

back to Hana for a minute, I'm thinking she may get a chance at her exposition during the next ep - if there's room for her story during HRG's.

Oh, hey, brainstorm - what if Jessica explains her flight to NYC by taking the family with her? Time to tour NYC - which would fit in with the whole family somehow being there at the bomb site,(all the supers drawn to the bomb) with Matt (traffic cop mode) directing them away from the source of the bomb, trying to usher all the supers far away. (presumably so they dont overwhelm Peter while he's trying to defuse radiation man)