OFFICIAL: Season 1 Heroes Discussion Thread!

[sleeper]

I hope Hiro can somehow help the waitress. She was an interesting character. Too bad if he can't. Poor Ando just sitting there helpless, and what is he going to tell the Sheriff when he comes back to take their statements. Sad. And there is the whole ranification of changing past history... maybe this is something that Hiro needs to force him to grow up.
Sylar is pure evil.. seems like there is no grey in his motive. Now HRG seem to do his thing for good even if he does bad things. In what way were they going to use Nathan when they kidnapped him... It was a botched kidnapping job..or was it? HRG and Blink are too good at what they do. That is probably why they have not messed with Peter. He could be a big force when he figures out how to use his power.

You just know that Nuclear man is the reason that NYC blows up. But how... does Sylar get too close to him or does Homeland security? He is a wildcard because he can't seem to be able to control his powers well.

Heh, the evil waif has the power of persuasion. But it seems like it only works when she really believes that what she is saying is true... Could she be in love with Mohinder and that is the reason she couldn't talk him into staying?

The boy that haunts Mohinder seems like he is going to be a big key in helping Mohinder get back on track in solving his dad's work. I like how this story line is evolving.

I agree with you Mreen, about good luck with Matt trying to find Blink... You almost would think that Blink would be a match for Sylar...But Sylar, whew, he is one bad dude.

[sleeper]

One other note... does Hiro messing with history cause Sylar to switch victims from the waitress to Claire? Ouch...

It was kinda sad to see HRG emotions when he sees Claire working on the Banner which in one of Isaac's paintings is covered with blood. Maybe Claire's blood?

[Mreen]

Probably not Claire's blood, since it is splattered all over as Ando and Hiro stare up - probably one of Sylar's pin cushion jobs that he does as he approaches a victim in the presence of other people. But - I hope it's Claire's - she's the only one who could recover from that much bloodloss! ..and in seconds or minutes .. enough to continue running.. it could work .. I just have a bad feeling about it.

HRG is a good guy in his own mind, but its all a justification for the evil he commits in the name of science. Those few disciples he brings in follow the cults goals even more religiously than he does, the desire to capture and catalogue everybody 'special'- Sylar could easily be a product of them, tho there is no reason to suggest he is NOT HRG - he certainly talks like HRG, that same insidious inflection in his speech, the pattern itself suggesting what he desires being the natural course of events .. makes you shudder to hear either one of them talk about their goals....
(Plus HRG is The Face of Evil and Sylar having no face ..kinda makes them work well together ... and yes, I have seen all the foreshadowing for another character .. I'd just prefer it not to be him over HRG)

rats - everything I typed last night is gone but this little bit.. oh well, lets see what I remember from that mass of semi connected theories, conclusions and conjecture... wont be as good as the first time, but here's my reconstruction.

*rummaging up thru a tired memory* lets see -I remember posting something about that being a cool idea, that Hiro's rescuing the waitress causes Sylar to skip the waitress and going directly to Claire. Afterall, we know she is pretty much the last one on his list before Nuclear Man, so any people skipped are lives saved. Pretty nice idea there.

Oh there was something I posted about HRG's little cult ... well, I remember the bit about the Evil Waif.
I think the only reason she didnt use her power on Mohinder to make him stay was to make her feel better about herself, only relying on all the other Evil Waif ways of manipulation to try and influence him. And I think she thought maybe he'd figure something out if she made him delay the funeral unreasonably. But I'm not so sure she didnt use her voice trick when she told him he'd be back. There was a funny look in her eye when she talked about that - or maybe she was just using the nonmutant standard Evil Waif version of the command with the kiss, and using the voice would have been redundant .. but, like I said, I'm not so sure she wasnt using the voice.

Nathan caught HRG and Blink flatfooted with his escape. They were so sure of themselves, and their look of surprise as he flew away from them was priceless. "That wasnt supposed to happen. Where's a copy of the script? I wasnt giving the rewrites!"

(Incidentally, why did Nathan say he didnt know martial arts, to Peter? Maybe he's no blackbelt, but he's clearly not forgotten any combat training.)

Peter's nobody's target right now because just hasnt passed anybody's benchmark on what it takes to be a target. Even Sylar missed him, only seeing Nathan as a target. While he may have met a timetraveler, has a brother who can fly, and knows a guy who can paint the future, nobody in the cult or public has seen him do anything - he could just be a shill that the supers are using to carry messages back and forth.The fact that Mohinder spent a whole day with him and ended up writing him off as a nutcase says a lot. Kidnapping people does take resources, and Peter just hasnt seemed a worthwhile target to anyone yet.

I think if they did kidnap Peter they'd end up being very surprised - first when he couldnt fly despite various stimulus they might try (ouch!) and then secondly when he absorbs all the powers of all their prisoners and turning the disciples powersagainst them (I see him leading a breakout of all the prisoners )

That is until next week - the previews looked good! It seems Peter is going to be very very busy - and he may work himself up everybody's list all at once.

Ando is going to have to be the new link man for an ep, I guess, joining Hiro and Peter together by relaying the right messages, hope he survives the next eps alright!

Mohinder only escaped because HRG was thinking he'd start with banter and bait him, and then end up with an exchange of information probably ending in Blink being there when the taxi stopped, so that HRG could make the information all one way. Mohinders sudden quick driving, slamming HRG's head against the cabroof and then Mohinder running off,left HRG's plan a little truncated. But he simply switched to plan B "Install Evil Waif to look after him and swipe all his research" and he got to go home early instead, without an interrogation to supervise. A tradeoff with little more than headache to pay for it.

Oh - I know what I had said!- I noticed that HRG didnt renew next months parking pass, and when you got past the cover place, everything had a packed and ready to go look, with more hurried packing going on outside the little room they keep Isaac in - think he's ready for a change in location?

And when Evil Waif accidentally revealed herself to Claire - what exactly was her breach of protocol there? Was it that she was supposed to befriend Claire later if she bolted, to spy on her and eventually command her to turn herself in? Or was it just that HRG somehow thought if he could keep Claire completely separate from his disciples, that he could keep his roles separate in his own mind, mad scientist out pulling Mengala experiments on people like her vs his role as Daddy of Daddy's Little Girl?

I really think its more the latter- he really doesnt want to have to make the heartbreaking decision of which is more important - no wonder he told her to stay Daddy's Little Girl as long as possible, more to spare him than her. She has her own reasons for going along with the suggestion, of course.

I said all of this more brilliantly last night of course...

[sleeper]

Well, well, well, well, well !

Interesting episode, to say the least.

Did Eden and Wink really get the upper hand on Sylar or will he be able to turn the tables and get away?

Poor Peter, is he in big time trouble? or does HRG come to his rescue... for a price?

HRG finally gets what he probably wants, a honest Clarie whom he might be able to manipulate..... or do I assume too much and Clarie tells him another half truth?

So does this mean that Radioactive man is solely responsible for the big explosion or is Sylar still involved and is able to kill Isaac? Did Hiro going back to the past mess everything up?

The shark(Nathan) is just plain evil.... and I am sticking to that statement unless he does something good for someone without any strings attached.

Does Jessica actually think that she can kill D.L. with a bullet!!??.... I think not. It will be interesting to see if D.L. and the Son can help Niki control Jen.

I will add more later, still have to digest this....heh.

[Mreen]

That was a great ep. And I have lots to comment on about it - but first the story...

so, I know this is the big ep of this half of the season - The Big One, kind of like the midseason midterm of Farscape ... maybe even in a two parter sense, but .. I really looked forward to this ep.

Monday nights I get home a bit late - I had to stop for Thanksgiving supplies at the mart, ended up home around 7:30, and glanced and saw that my DVR was not recording.

Hmm - thats odd, Heroes should be recording on Scifi Channel, a repeat of last weeks ep. Wonder why they arent showing it/machine is not recording?

So I get closer .. turn the cable power on. Nothing. Try the TV again. Try different channels .. frozen pics, black screens, more black screen - silence and darkness.

Reboot the cable box, which has been given me trouble of late. It changes the time to midnight!
Now I know I'm in trouble.
Still, I should be able to watch the ep on regular TV and record it, or even online - I hop over to the computer ...and the modem lights are blinking funny, only 3 of the 4 lights are lit, half heartedly so at that, and one keeps blinking red at me instead of green, in that dying Darth Vader's system kind of way.

So all cable is out - it's not just the box this time!

eeeeee

eeeee

eeeee

Taking calm stock of the situation, I rush back to the TV and try to tune in channel 4, a little worrisome prospect on the old thing, now that the bunny ears have been many years put to rest when I finally accepted cable as a necessity. A fuzzy but acceptable 4 appears.

The VCR? goes straight to channel 10. 4's signal isnt strong enough to register on its autochannel. A scramble for the long unused remote reveals the channel is still there, if I force it to focus by manually punching the numbers in.
But this machine doesnt really record anymore, its just a hub for machines trying to connect to my worn TV.

The DVD player - thru the VCR - shows nothing! changing channels.. nothing! Many blind button pressing thru the hub finally reveals that the VCR actually was watching Cable 3 instead of the video channel and that the DVD recorder is working fine. Channel 4 - very decent reception, best yet, so at last I have a way to view the channel.

My sister calls - she's been going thru a comedy of errors of her own all day, so helps me track down the cable repair number, which I call and get myself on an automated list to be notified "when the outage in your area is repaired" We go over her day, got a part to fix the stove so we can have Thanksgiving at her house, wrong part, returns that while hubby tackles the bathroom sink , comes back with new stove part, he sends her out for new sink parts, shes back at the store when he calls her and lets her know the store sold her a broken part for the stove so .. and it goes on. and on, all day, with broken parts, new glue dried up in its tube, glued parts going down the upstairs sink with hubby heroically racing down the steps and catching them in the lower drain before they stuck to something , using magnets on strings to pull up metal parts that flew down the drain next - I told her it wasnt just an ABC afternoon special going on down there, it was an episode of 3-2-1 Contact! And then I am begging off the phone so I can manually hit the record button and watch Heroes, while she tunes in down there.

I am formatting the disc - miss "the story so far", curse you digital slowage! and then record ... of course, w/o DVR capability I cant just rewind and record it all anyway

And then I record the show! and its going swimmingly - okay, so I realize its recording on way too low quality and stop it after the first commercial and get the rest on better quality, I only get a few commercial bits by accident, then at 9:30 my machine gets a call from another machine saying the cable is fixed! Next commercial break I tune everything over to the cable box, which now say 9:31! but .. the cable is acting funny. At first it says parental block, which I release, then it switches to channel 2 - I get it back to 4, which it insists has no data. DVR lists my shows still n there, with Heroes still programmed to record, but it cant find any shows. So I set the DVDR to record manually. "Cant record manually on this channel" - well, why not??? No answer from the cryptic box , but it does now show the channel and Heroes is coming in. So I continue my ordinary DVD recording on my other machine, off the cable feed now.

and ... just as it ends, the director I guess referenced the comic book squares that Peter referred to when putting together Isaac's paintings. Interesting touch. The picture continues in a small square, which appears in different places on the screen. Top right. Top left. Bottom left. Bottom right. Middle. Kind of floating .. wait a minute - its like a screensaver! My box is turning the pic into a screensaver, like its pausing or has something on hold!

So .. I have a very interesting version of the show, like no other on my DVD


and was the ep worth all that trouble?
Of course it was!!

[sleeper]

Sorry to hear that mreen. I won't say anymore until you've seen it all. My DVR messed up again and I just saw the last 5 minutes. So I had to get on NBC.com and watch it. It was a great episode...

[Mreen]

Oh that's okay, I think I saw the whole thing.. just not in "large" TV screen size

[Ancient_Einstein]

Peter may be the best one to fight Sylar in a prolonged battle since he used can copy his power.

I'm hoping Hiro and the dinner girl survive.


Most of all I'm really glad that Mr. Bennet has turned out to be a real character with real conflicts instead of just the big ominous bad.

He seems to do what he does out of some sense of duty, though without moral restraint. He does seem to honestly care about Claire.

I still think he'll end up being an enemy, but it seems he'll be of more interesting three dimensional variety, like Scorpius or Crais when he was bad.

[Mreen]

All great evil characters are three dimensional, tho I would argue that Scorpy was, despite his motivation, almost an embodiment of evil on his own. Certainly he was the embodiment of Vengence. But one does love to know why people are being evil, it lends so much more to the story.

Peter would be good since Silar has so many abilities - we've seen him heal, cut, levitate, fly, know he freezes people as well ... but on the other hand, if he finds out Sylars power by having his head cut open, well, it doesnt do him much good- particularly since he didnt heal as fast as Sylar, in fact I think he may have been dead till Claire got really close, despite her having been there earlier. I was glad her power lasted longenough for him to recover that foot after she left.
('scuse me guys, I need to put my foot back on right...)

I doubt HRG will be flying to Peter's rescue - more likely he'll be happy to have him locked up, despite rescuing Claire, as it makes him an easier target from their point of view. Much more trackable, he can grap Peter when he makes bail. Hopefully Peter's actions have saved the world - with Claire alive, and Sylar locked up, maybe Nuclear Man wont explode on the 8th .. or at all.

we'll see...
(I have no confidence in HRG's ability to hold Sylar for very long ....)

[sleeper]

(I have no confidence in HRG's ability to hold Sylar for very long ....)

Yeah, it seemed too easy. Who knows what power Sylar has absorbed to be able to get out of the grasp of the Evil Waif(should I call her that or just Eden?) and Wink.

So far we have seen Sylar avoid bullets, contol people, survive a 3 or 4 story fall (btw did Peter break Sylars fall?), be able to disappear and reappear quickly. Who knows what other tricks he has up his sleeve. And if Wink and Eden did catch him, can Wink erase Sylar's memory like he did the QB?

It's interesting to see that Eden has a consence and that might lead to a romance with Mohinder and a hard choice for her between him and HRG.

So we saw Isaac's latest painting, which Radioactive Man was glowing brightly...scary. Can Matt stop him.. RM seems to trust him and how can Claire stop RM from blowing himself up? I guess she is the only one that can get close to him when he is in such a state without causing her to burn up. (Remember the train wreck.)

[sleeper]

Looks like next week's episode will be sort of a prequel. They are going to show how everybody first found their powers with alot of Mohinder's Dad in it. It shows Eden meeting Matt and Mohinder's Dad meeting Sylar. Also it looks like Mohinder's Dad contacted HRG first.... interesting.

[Mreen]

so little time to post

But I loved the ep -seeing everything from Hiro's time line 6months ago, a bit of an eye opener on all levels!

Watched the Hiro's marathon - was shocked at how much they cut up the episodes- whole conversations gone! But my sis was shocked at how much she'd missed, watching it this time round - she has a 2yr old <g> and only watched the other eps in glimpses, with the 11yr old filling her in on plot details as it went - she saw all these scenes, this time round, that she'd never seen - said she was shocked at some of the revelations!

So it did some good <g>

And Sylar wasnt someone we knew! Jaws dropping all over, we'd all pegged it as having to be somebody we knew, tho we didnt want any of the characters to be him really. Its kind of nice when the mysterious figure out of nowhere is actually a mysterious figure out of nowhere .. and we get background filler at the same time so we can feel he's part of the story all along, instead of just 'some guy'.

The immutable past will provide Hiro with a severe limitation, important for someone of his abilities.. tho scientifically I say its nothing but ego that holds the past necessarily unchanged. Still, I hold history is pretty durable and the best stories work when there is continuity and the past still works out the way you saw it, you just might discover that what you saw wasnt what happened the way you think it happened

At least the waitress chose her fate (sort of) knowing she would die anyway, chose to wait to see Hiro again.

So, Jessica is a multiple personality and an absorbed twin, sorta <g> that's a twist I didnt see coming - Jessica has committed a lot of murders tho .. I have a feeling she wants to be put out of her misery. She seemed annoyed at her beginning, she thought Niki had finally learned to protect herself, but no, here Jessica was again, taking care of dear ol dad. I wonder if Jessica somehow hopes that if she is awful enough, Niki will have to protect herself rather than risk her, and Jessica can finally rest in peace (pieces anyway, the way she tears people apart) - who wants a rampaging murderer trapped in their body?

Nathan - finally we get to see him being nice to someone without an ulterior motive. He enjoys Peter's party, feels bad that his Dad loved Nathan better, tho selfishly he feels worse for himself as having the 'birthright' to try to be the rich one, while Peter gets to goof off by doing good deeds for low pay. All that's okay.
Ironically his career move that he wants to make is to take down Linderman - he wants it for himself as much as anything, and to restore family honor - Peter, of all people, tells him that's taking career too far, that emotional moral line is to let sleeping dogs lie .. or least daddy lawyers lie for a living.

But- Nathan gets his powers by finding himself torn from his wife when she needs him the most. So to Nathan the powers are worse than useless, more than an embarrassment, they are a menace, a poison that destroys things around him. But he is furious with Linderman, and his dad by default, and now - out of pure moral outrage and some vengeance for his wife- he is out to attack Linderman, this time with Peter by his side.

And on that day, Dad does himself in. Of course Peter is told its a heart attack, and that Dad didnt know. Bet you dollars to donuts Dad found out about the depositions and it put him over the edge. Either way, Nathan now feels guilty and resents himself and Peter for what they were about to do.

In other words, to Nathan, no good deed goes unpunished. So, instead, he throws himself in the congressional race, and even turns to Linderman for support. Gets himself owned by Linderman just like his dear old dad.. but I dont think he minds that so much. Nathan clearly admired his dad, and then lost the parent that cared about him the most.

He protected Peter somewhat from the truth, but I think he blames Peter too, on some level - and cant wait to teach Peter the harsh realities of life. For his own good, dont get me wrong, but he's been setting Peter up for a fall, then trying to push him away - Nathan is clearly frustrated how each plan he tries doesnt work out. He cant own Peter or buy him off or convince him to join his workforce. I think this lack of control over his brother is bothering him more and more and that's why we're seeing so many extreme measures on Nathan's part.

What's more interesting is we have seen in previous eps that Nathan is a master manipulator and its only when he tells the truth that Peter flat out doesnt believe him - even with the new insight and background we have, Peters natural empathy, particularly strong with Nathan, have clearly made him an easy target in Nathans eyes. Peter knows this on somelevel and when Nathan shifts ground, he tends to be suspicious ..just at the wrong moment <g>

And now we know where Micah got the computer he was fixing in Ch 1<g> and why Niki, as DL put it, tends to believe someone more when they are right there in front her, less when they are gone - she is a natural repressor of inconvenient facts.

HR only had Evil Waif for 6m? While interesting to see how she joined, that means she may not have been with the group long enough to qualify for dental and free parking. Her loyalty is strong, but her term with the cult may be short lived if she's already having a problem with how they treat the patients. "You promised never again" - this isnt the first time HRG pushed her to hurt somebody in that very short time. She may only last a yr at best with them .. I wonder how many recruits HRG goes thru in few years? Both Evil Waif and Blink are fairly young, HRG has been doing this for a generation at least. He killed off Claire's mom within the last 15yrs or so anyway. I wonder if she was really just an escapee, or a cult member who decided to quit - at the wrong moment.

I wonder if she's hanging around Mohinder bcs Chandra Suresh kept the computer copy and she's still trying to get Claire's name off of it. Does she realize there's more too it, that while HRG wants her off the list first and foremost, he's going to want to see the whole list, find out who he's missed out there? I dont think she's naive at all,she must see where its headed and be okay with that.

Matt's problems with his wife are pretty recent too, it seems. Wonder if its something they did too (I think more likely it just stemmed from his depression about failing second time)

Nuclear Man (or is Mr Atomic better?) wasnt touched - I guess cause we all know this is a disaster in the making, no need for us to see too much too soon. Next week should be exciting!

post more in those 'awake hours' later

[Mreen]

Adn now that I'm awake, I have no idea what it was I wanted to go on about, but was just too tired <g>

Tomorrow is the big ep - hopefully the cable will hold together! (Here me, cable? Hold together!)

[Ancient_Einstein]

I wonder if the importance of saving Claire had something to do with Nuclear Dude. Maybe he gets shot or something and panifc and injury cause his powers to go out f control, since he's radioactive Claire and Peter mimicking Claire's powers and being a trained nurse are the only ones who can get to him and help him with dying of radiation poisoning.

[Mreen]

actually that makes a lot of sense - Claire's the only one who can get close to him, but Peter has the medical knowledge - If Peter can get in there after being with her (tho he needs to be very close to get the powers, he says, I noticed he was drawing the future a whole day after being with Isaac - it must last a while, a good 12-24hours) Peter will need to be around a lot of them, and then with Claire to get up and help Radiation Man treated - I bet its a cut or something that goes out of control, then they can save the city. I hope its not Sylar cutting him .. not something I'm entirely sure a nurse could treat!