OFFICIAL: Season 1 Heroes Discussion Thread!

Talk about any show under the sun, genre or not.

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Postby chryse on Wed Feb 07, 2007 1:36 am

nix Bennett/HRG working for the gov't. :( Found out that in TX, driver's licenses are done by the Department of Public Safety (and that card looked exactly like a real TX license, except it didn't have Bennett's first name). Darn!

But hey, it seems that he may still work for Linderman.
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I should have been sleeping:

Postby Mreen on Wed Feb 07, 2007 5:58 am

In a quoting mood, tho I know we all can follow along without them <g>:

chryse wrote:Darn, I liked Linderman to be Claire's daddy. Oh well, it IS cute that Claire and Peter hit off so well when they met. Did Nathan ever see Claire when he went to get Peter? I think he didn't, but I'm not sure.

Nope- Nathan doesnt even know that he rescued a cheerleader, as far as we know. He and Peter communicated at some point -probably that call to the lawyer <g> but it may have just been messages, Peter still seemed surprised to see him actually come down to Texas (tho it may have been an after effect of the dream) So Nathan knows Peter went down to save a cheerleader, nearly died and got arrested for the death of cheerleader, and may or may not know that a cheerleader was rescued. As far as he was concerned, Peter screwed up. Like Nathan knew he would.
Claire was the only person that knows everything, tho we can be sure HRG put most of it together and was two steps ahead in that coma meltdown phase. -and did nothing to stop it, which is why I thought he may have arranged an illness. Guess not
- suppose that was why they added that bit with Nathan saying to Simone "Just before he passed out, he said something about absorbing too many powers."

Peter said nothing of the kind, he just rambled about being the bomb that sets off the city, and it all being his fault. But sometimes in this show they just like to get started with an idea already in the works, even if it hasnt happened yet. I shall kindly guess that Peter said a few more things in delirium the next time he woke up, and then passed out for two weeks.
Why slow the story down with details, when they do a pretty good job with them, for as many stories as they tell at once.


chryse wrote:I think HRG's been doing a really good job of keeping his family and his wife out of harm's way. He already knew that Claire was being targeted, that's why he was helping Isaac, and so took steps to keep her and the rest of the family out of harm's way. I think the only reason Sylar got to his home was because he'd locked up HRG in his own cell. You can bet that family security is going to get even tighter now that HRG lost Sylar and Sylar's made his intentions toward Claire crystal clear. As for keeping his wife's memories clear.. well, no one like Parkman is ever gonna get her husband's secret from her now is he?


If he cares more about his secret getting out than protecting his family, the erasure was a good idea - I just think the timing was far too premature. For all they know Sylar could have come barging back in, he'd only just pulled his disappearing act, and he'd easily handle the three of them if he put his mind to it. (ooooh - fine. I think I meant the pun, just a little.) If someone like Parkman did find out, you can bet he'd be a lot more useful in finding Sylar- it would make Claire a lot safer if Parkman knew. Off with the secrets and on with the rescue! :lol: Eventually Mom would get erased, but ..I would have let that one go at least a day. Just my little scold about security and what I would have done to protect Claire if she was my little girl!

Sylar went to the house to get Claire. He's got this creepy pervert thing going on about him now, as well as psychotic killer. Mom thought she had a pervert on her hands and was (slowly) beginning to connect him to the thing that killed Jackie,- and what the heck was going on with that deep voice bit?
Hey, on the Sylar bit - did anyone else besides me think he was using something from the cockroach as his model to 'fix' himself to be resistant to the drug and let himself die/appear dead? He was staring at it an awful lot ... reminds me a bit of Mohinders "God is a cockroach" speech *shiver* (not in a good way) :?

Revenge on HRG, killing off Mom, was just the bonus. But Claire's ability is at the top of his most wanted list, to keep healing and coming back. Pity he's got so much smarter/better memory now that he's got the waitress's talent. I actually dont think there's much of security system at the house, just the normal locks on the door. Zach had no problem scrambling in the window, nor Claire and he escaping across the lawn. Basic security systems have sensors, motion detectors, that sort of thing. Once Sylar tracked the house down, nothing may have kept him out anyway with all of his abilities- but there was nothing there. Maybe HRG will change his mind about that now!

I do love the little thing they threw at us this ep, that we have never heard HRG's first name. I didnt notice (I mean, he's HRG, not Mr Bennet, to me!) till 'Mom' did that big thing with almost saying his name, but not <g> Its a lot like the way they kept waving Chandra Suresh's picture around every ep, each time it was not the picture they showed us in the ep before. They really started emphasizing that pic, once they knew the viewers knew :twisted:

chryse wrote:Isaac doesn't know that Eden is dead does he? Poor guy.... I don't think he's turned to the dark side. As far as he knows, Eden and Bennett helped him a great deal and does so for other supers as well. He considers them good guys, Bennett was trying to save his daughter and Eden helped him get over his drug addiction so that he could use his powers without the drugs. That's really all he knows about them.


Well, new cult members never really do know they've been turned to the dark side, now do they? Isaac thinks he's on the side of angels, just as Eden did, therefore anything and everything is justified by the cause. (I think he does know about Eden's death - she let him go before she died, but if he's been in contact with them since, I think HRG would have mentioned it - a good way to pressure Isaac to take her place. "We need you to replace the hero who saved you" kind of argument) He may have had his memory wiped about Eden forcing him to take drugs after he'd finally defeated the physical part of the cycle. Or maybe he just doesnt remember it all that well. But he thinks he's found the underground Justice League, he'll do whatever they ask, no matter how bad it seems. He's got to stop a nuclear bomb, a little spying and kidnapping is nothing - if HRG tells him to track down another innocent, Isaac would do it without questioning. Just like our Evil Waif, trying to turn her life around. She did a lot of bad things because she believed in her cause, but 6m down the line she was questioning why. When again she was given commands to hurt someone - and when she finally got Isaac better and then HRG asked her to hurt him, made her finally do it, that's when she knew she couldn't be the new moral person she wanted to be, and work for a group like this. She intended to leave this life behind the same way she left her old life behind, and start over by freeing Isaac, killing Sylar, and telling Mohinder the truth. Absolve the sins she could, since she couldnt bring back Chondra.

Will Isaac have a similar awakening? I dont know .. he was introduced very gently, and HRG even managed to explain that sometimes the subjects get killed trying to escape, without making it seem evil .. just a little flaw in the system that might happen someday to anyone, crossing the street and not looking both ways.

I really liked Isaac, dedicated guy, but I have a bad feeling about him and his role in the future. He sees that destruction when he paints - he's seen it happen more than anyone besides Peter, and we saw how raving mad Peter got for a while. Isaac would do just about anything to stop it, and once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate .. oh wait. That's the Force again.

Anyhow, I think Isaac is (entirely well meaning) dark horse that could go either way in the future eps this season. Have to see if he survives November 8th to guess after that.

chryse wrote:Simone's father seems to be playing a minor role too. He owns the building Isaac lives in and Isaac himself pointed out that the roof seems to be important.... more than just the pigeons for Chris to take care of.


To be honest, I thought Isaac was thinking that because he sensed Peter was on the roof. He kept trying to paint Peter and kept painting scenes around the city, and the roof -because thats where Peter and Chris have their little heart to hearts, its the only place he's returned to again and again.

But then when Simone talked about her dad wanting to let the pigeons be - I think her dad knew about Chris, and was his benefactor, in a small way. Why else would Chris have chosen that building? I wonder if he was an empath too, his ability working a bit differently .. but he sensed things and set the building up a certain way .(Superhero headquarters <g>) hoping to let Chris come up there, the same way Chris kept the birds. Let him go once a day, and he keeps coming back. "Sounds like free will to me"

chryse wrote:I wonder if HRG meant "old friend" in the good way or the bad way when Isaac called him about Peter and his "new" power to be invisible.....


Now, about this 'old friends' bit - I think we actually just got a bigger clue about whats going on here. Remember how I keep saying I want to know the trigger, what started off all these abilities 6 months ago, everyone all at once in this group? Well it looks like there was another group that happened a long time ago and HRG's thugs/cult went after them as well. But 15yrs ago, there was a breakout. Claire's mom, Meredith got away, believed killed in the fire. 15yrs is exactly how long Chris has been running away as well, cutting himself off from all attachments in fear of being caught, of giving himself away. HRG thought Chris was dead. He'd have had everyone Chris cared about watched for a long time, to make sure an invisible man wasnt lurking about. Chris's survival depended on being dead, staying dead... and then when it was safe, watching those he loved go on without him.

So - Five people were supposed to have died in that fire. How much do you want to bet Chris was one of them? Who else was there? What powers did they have? Did they die, are they also escapees from that little group - was HRG their Sam Jerard, hunting them down for what they were and what they did? Was this their only escape, turning the accident to their own gravesite so they could disappear among the ashes? (It had to be some kind of accident, Meredith would never have sacrificed her baby) Tune in next week, to see these questions barely prodded at bcs I dont think the writers expect the majority of viewers to have put all this together yet. But .. wow.

But I feel bad for Chris .. I have such a bad feeling about him ending up on an operating table in HRG's lab, or dying to escape such a fate.

chryse wrote:Ok, so Peter and Chris follow Simone to the roof... but they don't follow her and Isaac to dinner? Come on! LOL It was hug, and Simone was upset about Peter being lost, not anything Isaac was doing. *rolls eyes* Peter, stop being so stupid about women!


Yes, well, they were some distance away so ..some of the nuances were lost. To keep themselves from being heard, of course. Okay , so its mandatory soap opera stuff. Anyone caught in a love triangle must be misunderstood by at least one, possibly both others caught in the triangle at least 30% of the time. Its in the rule books, look it up. 8)

Besides, I think Peter had had enough. At this point he can convince himself there is another explanation, tho Chris is (cheerfully) pouring the poison down his throat. If he follows them to dinner [okay a) that might be bit harder to maintain no presence in a restaurant if people keep stumbling over you, but b)] Peter might find more irrevocable proof there, and he's not ready for that yet .. he needs to simmer a while before he deal with this. :cry:

chryse wrote:Chris was really hard on Peter. Throwing him off the building was not nice.


No ...not nice pretty much sums it up. I've been waiting for something to happen on that roof since the first time they went up there. (I was hoping for the flying as well) I think Chris only put 60-40 chance Peter would survive when he did it, but he did it anyway :shock: ..but while that makes him scary, also makes him kind of fun. He did take the whole day to train Peter before giving such a final 'lesson' ... so he tried to give him a chance. But he clearly is the maniacial kind of Ben Kenobi.

Did you see that Isaac painted Peter in mid flight falling straight on top of the taxi? Except that he was invisible in the painting so we didnt quite realize ... did you see it had advertisements for the historical display at the museum? The one with the sword ..well, the replica .. the connections follow thru again.

chryse wrote:Rather disappointed in Takei's appearance as Hiro's dad. I was expecting more acting, rather than just the traditional stern Japanese father bit. I was very proud of Hiro for standing up to his dad like that AND pushing his older sister in the spotlight. Takei was obviously going for the really old-fashioned Japanese male, with all the prejudices against women and all the expectations of the family's son. It's a hezmana of a thing to stand against that, especially when you've grown up with it, not just in your family but in your entire culture as well. Hiro's learning that it's not just a special power that can make someone into a hero.
Oh, Takei's car... license plate NCC-1701! LOL



:shock: :D :lol: I cant believe I missed that! so funny!

I agree too, that it was too bad they made him only there for such a short time and that he didnt get to do anything more in-depth. I had such hopes - bcs we know he can act and thought for sure they'd give him something to have fun with and cut his teeth into as well.

Do you think they edited out our story about Sulu? I thought for sure that Ando's comment about "Your father looks angry."
"He always looks angry."

was going to be followed by:

"Your father looks like Sulu."
"That's why he always looks angry."

or, you know, punchline of your choice. But I thought for sure that was the place for it, and that it got edited out.
very sad moment for me, not to hear that one. :cry:

On the other hand, Ando's instant infatuation of Hiro's sister, straight out of all the olderboys in Pokemon's reaction to any female nurse or cop (if you havent had to sit thru these, thank the powers that be that your little one wasnt Pokemon obsessed) was pretty funny. Kept the humor going.

Solution was awfully quick to turn dad around.. She'd been running 3 divisions while Hiro worked in a cubicle and dad never noticed till now? but time was a factor.. we'll see how it goes from here.

chryse wrote:What is Linderman going to ask of Nicki and DL now? *shivers up spine* It's scary.


I'm picturing tagteam assassin. :twisted: Jessica more than DL- DL just owes a favor, Jessica could take this up as a lifestyle. Money and killing, she'd have found her dream job. Till one day she decides to kill Linderman and the spiderweb unravels completely. Then she dies...very sad. Only Niki can save everyone now!

Aeryn wrote: "We're all going to die."


well.. seemed appropriate.

Do you think Matt, becoming obsessed, will be the next HRG, when the time comes for him to find a replacement? Him being HRG or Linderman, if he's the hire-er, that orders HRG around. I see our really decent guy and husband and family man, becoming the next Sam Gerard obsessed if he doesnt get a support system under him.
Last edited by Mreen on Thu Feb 08, 2007 2:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Mreen on Thu Feb 08, 2007 1:58 am

So - I wonder what task the heroes of 15yrs ago had to perform, and - presumably they succeeded, since we're all still here - if the people they saved individually then are still around now.


Now it seems that the special people are strongly drawn to each other. Hiro and the sweet, smart, waitress. DL loves Niki, so they had little Michah, gifted too. Nathan had an affair or dated a firestarter, (producing their own superbaby) had a night with Jessica after a date with Niki .. which begs the question - what power might his wife possess? What will his little boys be up to?

Simone was dating Isaac and when she felt burnt out, she didnt turn away till she walked past Peter after he started using his power. She claimed it was confidence she saw about him... but, ladies, aside from a guy's conceit, did a sudden boost in confidence that means a guy wont be there when you need him, say, for your dying dad, ever be a turn on for you? I think she's drawn to the special people too, which means she might have some (so far latent) gene in her too.

Every relationship is a clue about someone else, in the end.

I mean... this means in season 2, Jessica may be pregant with Nathan's child. But, could Jessica seperate from Niki and have it on her own? Doesnt seem likely, but something is about to change drastically with those two. Chalk that up in the 'whatever' catagory, still have this season to get thru.
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always one more thing

Postby Mreen on Thu Feb 08, 2007 2:08 am

btw, did you notice that Linderman didnt free Niki till Jessica had been triggered? I think he put the shrink up to it, and wanted a trigger of some sort so that it would be Niki shut down and Jessica in charge 90% of the time. I dont think the shrink understood what she was getting into at all, poor thing.
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Postby chryse on Thu Feb 08, 2007 2:35 am

wow, you wrote a lot mreen!

I really, really hope that Sylar didn't get anything from the roach. That would just be too gross. I think they did that just to underscore Mohinder's "God is a roach"" speech, and just for that... I really hope!

HRG's house doesn't necessarily need tech security. Someone is watching... otherwise the hanging of the wind chimes outside Claire's window wouldn't let her summon the Haitian to talk to. And it's those watchers who can tell the difference between Zach climbing in and Claire sneaking out as opposed to an assault by a super. And Sylar was disguised in a Primatech uniform, a home delivery wouldn't be too unusual an occurrence. It looks like HRG was only working with the Haitian and Eden, but then there's also a doctor (now dead) and who else? Who were all those people fixing up the house after Sylar trashed it? Who funds OWI (organization without initials)? The organization is well equipped and well funded, and can work with a minimum of personnel, but can also call upon other personnel (like the Dr.) to help when needed. So there are more people working for HRG than we know.

Until Sylar found his driver's license, he didn't know where to go to look for Claire other than the high school... and then he got mislead by Jackie's grab for the spotlight. Whereas Sylar's been able to go to the home of everyone else he's killed. HRG has been keeping Claire way under the radar, and incidentally, the rest of his family too. HRG doesn't have Parkman, but he knows Parkman's ability... so, who else might have it as well? The fewer people who know about Claire's ability, the better.

I think there's a pattern to the supers appearing as well. We are pretty sure they appeared in Japan's past because of the sword (is it supposed to be 500 years ago (Musashi's time)? Or 1000 (Minamoto's)? or maybe both?), and now we have evidence that something also happened 15 years ago to Chris (his character's name is apparently Claude *as in Rains*), likely to Claire's mom and Claire as well. And possibly Nathan.

Nope, didn't notice that Peter's flight down was in Isaac's painting. I thought the cab was Mohinder's cab, when he was working as a cabbie, and possibly gone back to it. I did notice the "Samurai" exhibit sign Peter fell on.

"Your father looks like Sulu."
"That's why he always looks angry."

bwahahahahahahaha! That would have been GREAT!

Pokemon are well to me. *sigh* But Ando was very funny with Kimiko.

I don't think that Parkman will become the next HRG. I think he's too much a nice guy, and his power to hear people's thoughts... well, he ain't an empath, but that's just as bad. Parkman's a nice guy, deep down. He forgave his wife her affair and tried to fix things with her by being honest. Sure, he could change, but I think he'd have to have some massive losses and traumas before he could turn into another HRG. He's too mad about being used by HRG to want to become like him. As he learns more about himself and the other supers, I think he'll actually be less likely to become like HRG. His biggest problem right now is that he just doesn't know what's going on and it's driving him nuts.

Not everyone who is drawn to the supers has to be a super, or a latent super. It doesn't seem like Mohinder's parents were, yet his sister was apparently one as well. It could be that the genetic marker is more likely to appear in Simone's children, for example, and so because Nature needs supers now, she's attracted to them. But if you're right, I wonder about Nathan and Peter's parents. Dad is dead, but Mom is alive and well.... did/do they have latent powers too?

it could be much more prosaic as well. The supers are drawn to other supers because they each sympathize with having a strange power, like Hiro and Charley bonding, partly because of it. But I don't really believe that. The relationships are a clue...

Heard a whisper that the sword and Takei will be used more in Season 2 rather than season 1, but it could just be speculation.
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A lot ..bwhahahhah

Postby Mreen on Thu Feb 08, 2007 3:32 am

a lot? I wrote half of an English paper, it looks like - an amazingly disorganized English paper that jumps around more than paint spatter - I must have edited half a dozen times since I put in, realizing it was just a morass of typos and missing words, trying to make it half legible is a chore :? but fortunately I discovered I like editing so I dont mind. :P

Except that is such a huge post that I have to scroll down half the encyclopedia to insert the word missing from the sentence that I noticed .. :roll: :D

since I ended up on new page (heck, that post was a page!) just as well I included the quotes I guess. Never let me near a keyboard at 1 am again!

...just kidding. 1am is a fun time to write.

Ahem. No, I dont think HRG had anyone watching the house, or he would have been called when his kid left the house when he specifically said his plan was to keep her home, despite Evil Waif's scoffs. I think, up till now, he honestly didnt feel the need. Seeing that windchime tho, meant to him that now he knows the Haitian is watching the house, but to spy on him and help Claire, and that something is going on. It threw him, but he retreated to conceal his reaction. Claire is in trouble and doesnt even notice yet.

Tho, jumping track for a moment, I wonder what Claire will think. She found broken glass, her mom was beat up and mind erased, her dad has a bloody temple (fingers didnt show any damage at that shot, and I dont think we are going to see a dinner scene where she sees his hands are scabbed) I wonder if she is going to think her dad attacked her mom and mom's memory was wiped. She is questioning everything right now, it would be easy for her to jump to wrong conclusions in either direction, and if she chooses to question Blink about it, Daddy's going to spot them this time, and then Blink will be in real trouble. Maybe excommunicated from the cult.Claire.. left alone again.

As for HRG's group - its huge. You saw them, carting everything around and the rooms they built to cage Isaac in and special power loss room the guards and locks on the door. Everyone on the door behind that office is part of it, this cult/business venture/scientific experiment has been going on the better part of two decades and is searching globally for information on new subjects. HRG only answers to .. Linderman, I guess, or Professor X <g> everyone else works for him. I would guess a minimum of twenty employess, and easily upwards of 50, maybe more.

I mean, Linderman knows no boundries, and if they are with him.. well, same rules apply.

oh ewwwe - worse than a cockroach moment, I just realized Sylar's private joke when he said "I guess he just looms larger than life when he's drilling you" and the hole in his head. yeech. eck. ickypoo.

Sylar didnt have Claire's name, you are right, so Evil Waif must have gotten her off the list like she was supposed to. But Mohinder has the older list in India, and she is likely still on that one. We'll see soon enough tho...

I hope you are right about Matt tho.. I dont want to see him end up that way. He is a really nice guy. And -tho Mohinder and Peter havent hit it off at all the way I thought they would - Peter and Matt instantly worked together. Matt felt for the guy with the headache and offered the aspirin, and Peter jumped to tell them who needs to be guarded, as soon as he realized he was in the presence of fellow ..ah, super. He could give the information without worrying about convincing them of the impossible, because Matt would know it was the truth. We'll see tho, all the characters are 'transforming' so to speak, and sometimes that means for the worse as much as for the better. Cross our fingers that we get to keep Matt around as a good guy.
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Postby Mreen on Sat Feb 10, 2007 2:24 am

Another thought about Charles Deveaux ...(looked up the spelling!) Simone's father.

I said earlier I got the impression he was an empath, and somewhat Chris/Claude's benefactor. I wonder if he is the opposite of HRG's boss/(Linderman?) -instead of hunting down the people born with powers, he understood that they are drawn together, and tried to exert a benevolent influence over them/for them, allow them to live free and let their power grow. He stayed in that building when he knew he was dying, Chris returned there every day for his birds, Isaac lived there and Peter came to work for him there.

Simone said that Peter was like a son to him - we took everything that happened as examples of Peter's extraordinary empath tendencies, that he felt and cared deeply for his patients and they responded to it. But what if it was more than that - what if Peter kept dreaming while he was at work because he was being influenced by Charles? His own empathy being emphasized and growing under the influence of an unconscious (or at least subconscious) mentor - gently trying to show Peter the way, to let him understand what was going on with him and to encourage him to follow the new instincts that were driving him.

The more I think about it, the more I think how we underestimated this guy - when he died Peter was in his own apartment and they were sharing a dream. A dream in which Peter told him everything and showed him flying around the city. The man told his daughter that Peter flew him around and was going to save the world. What if the power of the dream came from him and not Peter? He missed him and reached to Peter, so that he could have his goodbyes and see where his successor would go? Give him one last bit of fatherly advice and encouragement.

Peter started being a hospice nurse 6m ago ... what if that was when Charles need him? He was drawn to the job, to work for him, maybe almost the whole six months. Maybe it was Charles dying that triggered the response in the next generation - he was reaching out to everyone that was needed to save the world this time, and awakening them to the gifts they'd need to get the job done.

Yes, I am really reaching out here .. but the more I think about it, the more convinced I am that this is where the story began, .. I love having no spoilers and speculating like this :) because it means I can guess anything and talk about without giving anything away - because I dont really know a thing! all just stuff I made up or guessed from threadbare hints and facts along the way *really smug emoticon should go here* :mrgreen: Mr Green will have to do

I also wonder if Chris/Claude has never taught anyone before, he's just trying to teach Peter what Charles tried to explain to him about how empath abilities work. What if Peter is the first empath to find him since Charles died? What if the real reason he followed Peter, tho he may convince himself it was the bomb, was because he was lonely? He may not like Peter, (tho I think he does somewhat inspite of himself) may find Peter's ability a danger to his existence (and therefore makes himself a bit of danger to Peter).. but cant help but keep an eye on the only guy to know he's alive out there in the world. I wonder if Charles kept repeatedly trying to train Chris to use his gift and kept failing - how long it took Chris to find a way to become invisible when he needed it, and how much he really controls it now - does his fear keep it on all the time?

You know, I have typed in a ton of stuff since the last ep. I think I figured it out - its not like it was the best ep they've done so far, but I always liked this show and love to speculate about it.. But its been over a year since Chris played the Doctor - and while I think Chris has done a great job in every role he's played, and this character is really nothing like the Doctor (except both are damaged and lonely) ..but I think I really enjoyed watching him run about like a maniac again, trying to save the world. :D The combination of the two has set my keyboard just humming with bright ideas that seem much clearer at 1 am or a few nights with less sleep than I should be getting <g>
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Postby Mreen on Tue Feb 13, 2007 4:43 am

huh .. Grandma is one cold fish. I pictured her, protective of Nathan but scolding him, going to comfort her young granddaughter. Not to be the evil Matriarch ordering him to cut them off. Dynesty soap opera in her blood .. I knew she had been like that, they left no doubts about her nature in the few scenes she had, but I thought she was the soft one of the pair. She and Nathan always spoke the same language and looked out for Peter in their own way. I just thought she'd extend the same feelings to her grandchild.

Poor mom - I worried about half her life being drained away.. now it looks like she's losing the other half. That's really sad. I think her brother has the same vulnerablity - he became extremely absent minded after his mind cleansing, his mother worried about him while HRG just wondered if Claire was hiding more secrets.

(I had wondered if his ability amplified others, hence his absentmindedness after being mindwiped .. now I guess that is her biological son instead of just the next adoptee on the list, and that was just foreshadowing)

This ep takes place in almost the same time as the last one .. okay its the next day ..but Isaac had said last week that he saw a way to trap Peter, and Peter and Chris werent even there (they never are <g>) Obviously, since Isaac paints the future, he just has to paint Peter and send HRG's goons to the appropriate setting.

Sylar is so nasty.. this is just the .. bad side of miraculous timing. He is convinced now that he's on a destiny, a quest, that he's doing this for a reason - he and Peter are like two sides of the same coin. They gain the powers of others, driven to do so - Peter because his empathic drives send him on quests to save people, Sylar because his psychotic desire for attention has evolved into a quest to make himself the most powered man he can be - an inward journey to becoming his own god.

Creepy.

They named this ep 'Run' which is interesting .. because I would have called it more like "Hide" - next ep it looks like the terror of the chase is on.

Matt .. ah Matt. He was so good, better than Mous-ski had right to expect, and evil Jessica was really the only one who couldnt be stopped by him. But .. then.. damn. Nice guy is now corrupted. He's already labled a liar and loser. Does he have to add theif - and have that worst last one be true? Now Linderman's going to come after him.

Weird that Linderman would send Jessica after Nathan. Nathan has done everything he said he would and more, kept a close relationship with Linderman from the day the series began (nevermind the 6m ago straying) he went from anti-Linderman DA to Linderman's pet. Linderman has the tape to control him. There is no reason to send Jessica after him... unless its a test. He's looking to pit them against each other just to see what happens. An experiment to see what Niki does to Jessica does to Nathan and how he'll get out of this one. Also possibly to help HRG smoke out Peter, by threatening Nathan.. or tackle them seperately if they cant get them together.

Nathan is the only 'hero' to escape HRG's kidnap attempt since the show started (not counting Sylar's escape later). Maybe Linderman thinks this will do it.
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Postby sleeper on Tue Feb 13, 2007 3:03 pm

You forgot the side story of Ando and Hiro. Looks like they are both in trouble. I wonder how Hope is involved in all of this and how far Ando will go to help her out, before he figures out what kind of stinker she is. Hiro could be in some major trouble with the NGC... I hope not.

And I am disappointed in Matt...he shouldn't base his future on what one person thinks about him. What does one person really know. Was the guy that Matt was guarding the warden of the prison that Jessica/Niki was in?
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Postby Mreen on Tue Feb 13, 2007 7:24 pm

No- he was Linderman's fixer upper, the attorney and arranger of deals.

He collected the 2M from DL, then followed instructions to get an order for Jessica's release. Looks like he then took off with said 2M and headed to LA .. big mistake.

Still am so disappointed with Matt, he really dropped on the scale of goodguys. I knew he might, that things were leaning that way.. but I wanted to be an optimist about his moral character, that he would stay the good guy in the face of obsticles.

Yes, the bit with Ando and Hiro and Hope was the comic relief in the grim ep tonight, the bit that kept us going. I dont think Hiro is in much danger unless he was the guy that threw Hiro out last time (I think he was, have to recheck) but Ando is about to get his butt kicked by Hope's new boyfriend - or just her. I think she could handle him. Poor Ando - but I loved how he kept quoting the hero quotes all over the place whenever Hiro pointed out that it didnt look like a good idea...
"Stop saying things that I say!!" lol

Feel so bad Mrs Benett tho...
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Postby chryse on Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:36 am

Poor Claire. Poor Mrs. Bennett. HRG is really messing things up with his family and he hasn't really got a clue about that does he? Meredith is alot more cold-blooded than I thought she'd be, grabbing the money and running. Bimbo! Claire doesn't deserve you. And Claire believes that Nathan is a jerk too.. well, he is, but he cares for his family, and Claire is family, grandmother not withstanding. Her attitude was surprising, but maybe not unexpected. She was the wife of a powerful man for a long time and has probably gotten a lot of extortion schemes in the past. And Nathan's about to get even more powerful. Her first instinct is to protect her son, even from himself, from what could possibly be a hoax. It's that timing thing again. I've a feeling that all their emotions would have been different if they knew she was the cheerleader Peter saved.

Poor Mohinder. He's gonna team up with Sylar not knowing he's Sylar. *sigh* Well, Sylar's gotta pull up his sleeves sometime, then Mohinder will see his watch. And then I hope Mohinder can get away from Sylar quickly and cleanly.. or at least kill the psycho! I know, that isn't likely, but I'd love to see it.

Poor Matt. See, it's that telepathy thing that won't let him be a really bad person. His job is already on the line, and after the assassination, he's not likely to get another security job, and after the report about this incident, he really isn't likely to get his job back as a cop (he was already under suspension). So what's left? Taking the diamonds was petty (it seemed to me that he kept them more to spite the detective than anything else), but it's also a way for him to keep paying the bills for a while. Dunno if Linderman will go after Matt because of the diamonds. As far as Linderman knows, Matt's just a rent-a-cop and the other cops there are just incompetent fools. But Jessica's taken money from Linderman before... and hidden it in much the same way. I'd give even odds that the first person Linderman is going to suspect about the diamonds is Jessica, not Matt.

Perhaps Nathan is the next target because he's thinking about leaving Linderman? (Good call btw Mreen! You were half right about the hitman squad.) Or maybe it just seems that Nathan's doing a heck of lot of traveling on his own, possibly against Linderman's interests?

I wonder if DL will figure out what Jessica is doing? And what will that family have to say when they talk about their powers, like Micah wants? I mean really, how do you talk about stuff like that???

Poor Hiro. LOL I'm feeling really sorry for a lot of heroes today.
But let me explain something about him. Hiro grew up with Japanese myths and legends. In many of them, the hero of the story is already perfect, he doesn't change during the course of the story. No, in Japanese tales, the hero doesn't change himself, but he does change the world. The Hero may have flawed (read ordinary) companions, and then must adjust his actions to compensate for their flawed actions, but in the end, everything comes out right. The Hero, in many ways, is an incarnation of Buddha. The perfected soul doing good in the world to change it for the better. Hiro is the Hero, he is the one with with special powers, with the link to the perfection that is Buddha. Not Ando. So it's Hiro's instincts and decisions about what to do next that will always be correct, not Ando's, hence his misgivings about helping Hope, because that's the way it is in the stories Hiro grew up with. But Ando, living a more pragmatic life, doesn't see it that way... and it looks like it's gonna get him into a lot of trouble.
Too many clicks spoil the browse......
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Postby Mreen on Wed Feb 14, 2007 3:14 am

Michah's family meeting ought to be a good one, that I can tell you. I think there will be lots and lots to say that could keep that conversation pretty interesting.

Nathan .. is still in Linderman's hip pocket. He's been successfully persuading Linderman to help him over and over again - and Linderman has the tape if Nathan ever bothers him. The relationship appears to be a good one. There's just no reason for Linderman to order the hit. Seems like a game is being played to me.

One thing I did like about the Hiro and Ando bit - last ep Ando was babbling about there somehow being 3 weeks left before Nov 8th, this next ep (the next day to all the other characters) they mentioned they have less than 2 weeks. That means they are finally in synch with the timeline of the story! Yay to that! The countdown is important to this story - its not 24, but you have to keep that deadline inching closer as each ep covers maybe a day or two, sometimes less. Good stuff to be played out.
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Postby Mreen on Wed Feb 14, 2007 3:19 am

Its interesting that the traditional Japanese hero is unflawed - sounds like your basic western figures, perfect herom, goofy sidekick (to carry the flaws necessary to keep the drama going the way a perfect hero would not) The Budda connection is an interesting thought tho...
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Postby Mreen on Wed Feb 14, 2007 7:05 pm

Also - I think you're right about HRG not seeing what he's done to his family. He is incapable, it seems, of understanding the concept of individual rights or maybe even self determination. HRG decides what is to be done about people, and then gets it done.

He believes in a Mengela philosophy, that no thought should be given to the subjects wishes, what matters is what can or cannot be done with them, how much can he get away with (tho I doubt he thinks of it as 'getting away' with.. he sees nothing wrong in what he does) and how to best view the results.

He wants the people with powers to study. He grabs them, and lets them go when its convenient. He wants Claire to have a 'normal' life, he uses the same techniques. Erases her memory, spies, grabs tapes and files on her, to see what she does, and when he should step in and erase her memory again. Keep her normal, whether she wants to be or not. He wants her that way, he loves her, so that's the way it is.

His wife, when she noticed things all the time, wiped out. None of the effects mattered, so long as she was the way he wanted her, unsuspicious and ignorant. Now that things are going wrong - well, he loves her, I'm sure he's regretful of the effects, but a part of him must also consider her a control - now he knows what a couple decades of steady erasure does to a brain. Something to file away in the all important fact file at the OWI (love name for the Organization Without Initials, btw 8) )
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Postby Mreen on Fri Feb 16, 2007 5:42 am

Rewatching the newer eps... the bit where Claire and her friend are researching her relatives in Kermit, and Zach points out she might have a rich eccentric uncle.

"Oh, great, an uncle" Claire says - cute, that her uncle is her only blood relative that hit it off with her, her hero Peter :)

Grandma sees her as a threat, brothers dont know about her but are young enough not to like a 'girl' <g> and Nathan (The Shark) is deliberately choosing to be jerk, out of fear that his emotions will turn him into a chump.

So did Meredith start the fire that Claire saved the old man in? The opening pilot (unaired) showed a group of men in camouflage in a truck leaving scene as firetrucks approach it (only Claire notices them as the camouflage flap in the back of the truck flips up briefly as they drive by. I figured the untold story was how they started it.. maybe it was Meredith escaping them? .... no, the timing was only 4 weeks before, and Meredith had been in Kermit a few months. (maybe 6m ago, same as when her daughter's power awoke?)

At least Meredith didnt try to dress up Nathan as other than what he was, to Claire. And, for Claire's sake (as well as to drive the blackmail home) made sure Nathan saw her picture - and when she saw his reaction, she was ready to question Nathan, to see if he had changed since the last time he was presented with his daughter. She cared that much, at least.

But in the end, Claire was a child she lost long ago, thru her own efforts trying to escape the OIW run by HRG. She wasnt letting herself get too attached, and instinctively knew it was time to run (I thought HRG would be the one to make her disappear.. I think I may prefer that she's the instigator instead) She's not ready to get attached to someone she thought she killed - like Chris (Claude?) she's survived by trying not to care about anyone.

She's been on her own a long time, and become greedy .. the lie to Claire, that Nathan was only giving them 50K, but half that was hers, was unnecessary. She could have just told her "I'm giving you 25K from him." - but they wanted us to see that Claire couldnt trust her completely either. Which is a pity, because she didnt hold anything back about her ability from Claire before, even tho it's easy to guess how the fire started once Claire saw that ability. She didnt show Nathan, or tell Nathan about Claire's ability. (I had been wondering -before the ep began- if she would, and set Claire up to meet him so they could explain together Nathan would have the chance to come clean himself, tho I could only imagine him failing, short of Claire falling off a roof) So, she's not the adoring mother Claire wanted, nor supportive enough to help Claire in her time of need, but she does what little can, part with some of her escape money.

There's something else that I always mean to bring up.. :twisted:

The fact that Matt took 2million in diamonds bugs me more and more everytime I think about it. This isnt just the little character degradation a normal adult is subject too ... not reporting extra change, or even petty theft - he was a little riled about a detectives (unvoiced!) opinion so he retaliated by stealling TWO MILLION DOLLARS WORTH OF DIAMONDS? Money that just got the guy he was guarding killed?

I dont think so .. I could see him making a snide remark as he returns the money, or even keeping that one diamond Malski tried to bribe him with, ...but frankly two million in diamonds isnt going to pay the bills. He cant start cashing them in without being found out for one thing. (at least not for a couple years - and frankly, with TWO MILLION of diamonds involved, he's on the short list of people that will always ring Linderman's bells. Secondly, his wife only just told him she was pregant - she'd gotten a promotion at work months ago so she was making more money and would get maternity leave..they werent going to lose the house or anything if it took him a while to get a job. Frankly in LA, I doubt he'd be completely blacklisted <g> but still, he wasnt desperate enough to need the money, ...

Its just too much too soon. Maybe he'll spend the next ep kicking himself and finding a way to return the diamonds, we'll see.
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